Bits of history of the men behind your car

[/NDA]

Ze Germans:

Hitler was the father of VW. He redesigned Porsche's Beetle. Mercedes/Audi invaded Europe. BMW (engined bombers) bombed Ingland. Nothing new, I know, but it gets better, promisse.



The Brits:

Rolls Royce (engined bombers) bombed Germany. Jag, then SS Cars Limited only made the sidecars and helped with some aircraft parts. Rover produced engines for tanks and aircraft. Aston made the Atom and contributed but couldn't find what. Morris made tanks. I'm sure there's more so i'll let you add it.



Les French:

It all really started after the war with the 2CV, short for homicide on wheels and copying Hitler's idea of a people cars. Holding the record for absolut cheapest possible to produce, cheap to sell, lots of sales, lots of money. When you have your eye on the neighbors baguette, I guess that's the way to go. As long as the French keep themselfs to the track or rallying, they are very good. From my personnal experience, Renault was electronicaly impaired, specialy in sub 0*C - in farenheit that would be when water freezes - and in the 80s across the pond...

[/NDA]

The Italians:

Ferrari's Prancing Horse badge is a WWI pilot symbol. He was awarded an honor from the Fascist regime of Cavaliere dell’ordine della Corona d’Italia. With the second world war taking place and the car racing battles were stopped, Ferrari then became involved with war production. Enzo was shunned for his “reputedly too-enthusiastic support of the old Mussolini regime”. After the war, the CIA freed mafia captives and handed them entire cities, like Turin. It was a plan to counter the communists parties and so the Ferrari company flourished in the post-war economy of the 1950s, so did Fiat, Lancia, Alfa Romeo, etc. laundering the mafia's money. Lambo didn't get his money from the mafia tho, well not at first. I say that cuz I doubt they didn't knock on his door at one time or another. No siree, Mr Lambo money came from the tractor he sold with stolen tank engines.

On a side note, when Enzo Ferrari declared the infamous "aerodynamics are for people who can't build engines", it was after the silver arrows retired from motor racing. Leaving him to race the Britsh garagiste who stole the blue-prints from the Germans but were (after WWII - and still are) quality challenged. He went on believing "that the role of the chassis was to carry around the engine, and that if the engine was a Ferrari engine, it would as often as not win the World Championship. There is evidence today that this belief is as robust as Catholicism, deep down inside Ferrari. The shock of discovering that the new aerodynamics of the 1970's made it worthwhile compromising the engine to achieve superior chassis performance, was quickly followed by an even harder lesson to bear. The turbo-era suddenly transformed the science of Formula 1 engines from the attainment of the highest possible RPM, into the computer control of the highest possible cylinder pressures. It is no coincidence that Bosch equipped the first engines (BMW and TAG) to power "turbo-World Champions". When the Japanese brought their detailed and rigorous analytical approach to engine development, Ferrari had to face the fact that not only was the engine no longer the dominant part of the car, but also that Ferrari no longer necessarily built the most powerful engines." Peter Wright

[Memphis]

Saab made planes too not sure what they did with em

[/NDA]

Los Spanish:

Were and are still napping...



The Nipon:

Mitsubishi builded the airplanes like the A6M5 (Zero) with engines from Subaru, at the time they were 2 of the dozen of companies to be part of Nakajima Aircraft Co., Ltd. formerly knowned as the Fuji Sangyo Co., Ltd. and also there was Nihon Sangyo (Datsun/Nissan) for the land vehicles.



Os Portuguese:

Gone fishing...

[/NDA]

For desert, good ol' U.S. of A.:

First of, the short and sour part:

The following is excerpted from a report printed by the United States Senate Committee on the Judiciary in 1974

"The activities of General Motors, Ford and Chrysler prior to and during World War II...are instructive. At that time, these three firms dominated motor vehicle production in both the United States and Germany. Due to its mass production capabilities, automobile manufacturing is one of the most crucial industries with respect to national defense. As a result, these firms retained the economic and political power to affect the shape of governmental relations both within and between these nations in a manner which maximized corporate global profits. In short, they were private governments unaccountable to the citizens of any country yet possessing tremendous influence over the course of war and peace in the world. The substantial contribution of these firms to the American war effort in terms of tanks, aircraft components, and other military equipment is widely acknowledged. Less well known are the simultaneous contributions of their foreign subsidiaries to the Axis Powers. In sum, they maximized profits by supplying both sides with the materiel needed to conduct the war.

During the 1920's and 1930's, the Big Three automakers undertook an extensive program of multinational expansion...By the mid-1930's, these three American companies owned automotive subsidiaries throughout Europe and the Far East; many of their largest facilities were located in the politically sensitive nations of Germany, Poland, Rumania, Austria, Hungary, Latvia, and Japan...Due to their concentrated economic power over motor vehicle production in both Allied and Axis territories, the Big Three inevitably became major factors in the preparations and progress of the war. In Germany, for example, General Motors and Ford became an integral part of the Nazi war efforts. GM's plants in Germany built thousands of bomber and jet fighter propulsion systems for the Luftwaffe at the same time that its American plants produced aircraft engines for the U.S. Army Air Corps....

Ford was also active in Nazi Germany's prewar preparations. In 1938, for instance, it opened a truck assembly plant in Berlin whose "real purpose," according to U.S. Army Intelligence, was producing "troop transport-type" vehicles for the Wehrmacht. That year Ford's chief executive received the Nazi German Eagle (first class)....

The outbreak of war in September 1939 resulted inevitably in the full conversion by GM and Ford of their Axis plants to the production of military aircraft and trucks.... On the ground, GM and Ford subsidiaries built nearly 90 percent of the armored "mule" 3-ton half-trucks and more than 70 percent of the Reich's medium and heavy-duty trucks. These vehicles, according to American intelligence reports, served as "the backbone of the German Army transportation system."....

After the cessation of hostilities, GM and Ford demanded reparations from the U.S. Government for wartime damages sustained by their Axis facilities as a result of Allied bombing... Ford received a little less than $1 million, primarily as a result of damages sustained by its military truck complex at Cologne...

Due to their multinational dominance of motor vehicle production, GM and Ford became principal suppliers for the forces of fascism as well as for the forces of democracy. It may, of course, be argued that participating in both sides of an international conflict, like the common corporate practice of investing in both political parties before an election, is an appropriate corporate activity. Had the Nazis won, General Motors and Ford would have appeared impeccably Nazi; as Hitler lost, these companies were able to re-emerge impeccably American. In either case, the viability of these corporations and the interests of their respective stockholders would have been preserved."

Report presented to the Committee of the Judiciary, Subcommittee on Antitrust and Monopoly, United States Senate, February 26, 1974, United States Government Printing Office, Washington.

[/NDA]

We have sworn to you once,
But now we make our allegiance permanent.
Like currents in a torrent lost,
We all flow into you.

Even when we cannot understand you,
We will go with you.
One day we may comprehend,
How you can see our future.
Hearts like bronze shields,
We have placed around you,
And it seems to us, that only
You can reveal God's world to us.

Ford

[B18BSol]

Is this the same person that asked for help researching automobile advances in the 80s? If so, my god you're way better at research than I ever was...:thumpup:

Very interesting post, thank you

Any "History" on Honda? Like I said, I suck at research...unless it's to prove 500hpEVOIX wrong, over and over and over again.

[/NDA]

Originally Posted by B18BSol

Is this the same person that asked for help researching automobile advances in the 80s? If so, my god you're way better at research than I ever was...:thumpup:

Sure it was me? Can't recall, sorry

Very interesting post, thank you

Ya zvelcome. Meh, no bashing from the domestic croud, how exceptional.

Any "History" on Honda? Like I said, I suck at research...unless it's to prove 500hpEVOIX wrong, over and over and over again.

Soichiro Honda was born in 1906. He grew up helping his father repair bicycles in the little town of Komyo. At 16, he headed to Tokyo, 270 kilometers away, to take an apprenticeship at an automobile repair shop. At the age of 22, he opened a repair shop back in Komyo.

He took up racing and after a violent crash, he was convinced by his wife to retire from the sport. (pussy wiped ) The repair business alone was not enough to keep him occupied.. This restlessness led to his venture into piston ring manufacturing in 1937.

A lack of formal education in automotive mechanics brought Honda to the Hamamatsu School of Technology. Robert L. Shook, in his book Honda: An American Success Story, stated that Honda was a poor student in his school days. "Honda reluctantly attended classes while continuing to run his business. Honda stubbornly paid little attention to anything in class that did not relate directly to piston rings. He took no notes, nor did he bother to take written examinations. The head of the school told him he would not receive a diploma if he refused to be tested. With that, Honda retorted that a diploma had less value than a movie ticket. 'A ticket will get you a seat in a movie theater, but a diploma won't get you a job!'"

In addition to the zaibatsu, Japanese industry relied heavily on the gakubatsu, described by Shook as "the 'good old boy' networking system that placed more emphasis on what school a person graduated from than on his or her ability to perform on the job." Honda had no respect for this system.

In September 24, 1948 the Honda Motor Co. was founded. Soichiro Honda took advantage of a gap in the Japanese market that was decimated by World War II, Japan was starved of money and fuel, but still in need of basic transport. Honda, utilizing his manufacturing facilities, attached an engine to a bicycle, creating a cheap and efficient transport.

The Honda piston manufacturing facilities were almost completely destroyed. Soichiro Honda created a new company with what he had left, giving it the name "Honda Giken Kōgyō Kabushiki Kaisha" which translates to "Honda Research Institute Co. Ltd." Despite its grandiose name, the first facility bearing that name was a simple wooden shack where Mr. Honda and associates would fit engines to bicycles. Interestingly, the official Japanese name for Honda Motor Co. Ltd. remains the same, in honor of Soichiro Honda's efforts.

In September 24, 1948 the Honda Motor Co. was founded. Soichiro Honda took advantage of a gap in the Japanese market that was decimated by World War II, Japan was starved of money and fuel, but still in need of basic transport. Honda, utilizing his manufacturing facilities, attached an engine to a bicycle, creating a cheap and efficient transport.

The Honda piston manufacturing facilities were almost completely destroyed. Soichiro Honda created a new company with what he had left, giving it the name "Honda Giken Kōgyō Kabushiki Kaisha" which translates to "Honda Research Institute Co. Ltd." Despite its grandiose name, the first facility bearing that name was a simple wooden shack where Mr. Honda and associates would fit engines to bicycles. Interestingly, the official Japanese name for Honda Motor Co. Ltd. remains the same, in honor of Soichiro Honda's efforts.



Toyota Motor Co. was established as an independent company in 1937. Although the founding family name is Toyoda, the company name was changed to...

Signify the separation of the founders' work life from home life;
Simplify the pronunciation, and
Give the company an auspicious beginning. Toyota is considered luckier than Toyoda due to the fact that eight is a lucky number, and is the number of strokes it takes to write Toyota in Katakana.


During the Pacific War the company was dedicated to truck production for the Imperial Army. Because of severe shortages in Japan, military trucks were kept as simple as possible. For example, the trucks had only one headlight on the center of the hood.

Fortunately for Toyota, the war ended shortly before a scheduled allied bombing run on the Toyota factories in Aichi.

[BlairKunt]

Originally Posted by Memphis

Saab made planes too not sure what they did with em

Fly them.

Damn there is alot of info on Honda. Great post, thanks.

[low_civic]

nice research

[Nortad]

Originally Posted by /NDA

The Italians:Ferrari company flourished in the post-war economy of the 1950s

Lie. In the end of the WWII Ferrari was barely breathing, other wise, why did they have to make new race cars out of recycled parts from the previous cars? And they only started to make road cars to finance racing, and it was like that up until the late 70´s.

Originally Posted by /NDA

Lambo didn't get his money from the mafia tho, well not at first. I say that cuz I doubt they didn't knock on his door at one time or another. No siree, Mr Lambo money came from the tractor he sold with stolen tank engines.

Stolen from Italian and German tanks. Whats wrong with that?

Originally Posted by /NDA

On a side note, when Enzo Ferrari declared the infamous "aerodynamics are for people who can't build engines", it was after the silver arrows retired from motor racing. Leaving him to race the Britsh garagiste who stole the blue-prints from the Germans but were (after WWII - and still are) quality challenged. He went on believing "that the role of the chassis was to carry around the engine, and that if the engine was a Ferrari engine, it would as often as not win the World Championship. There is evidence today that this belief is as robust as Catholicism, deep down inside Ferrari. The shock of discovering that the new aerodynamics of the 1970's made it worthwhile compromising the engine to achieve superior chassis performance, was quickly followed by an even harder lesson to bear. The turbo-era suddenly transformed the science of Formula 1 engines from the attainment of the highest possible RPM, into the computer control of the highest possible cylinder pressures. It is no coincidence that Bosch equipped the first engines (BMW and TAG) to power "turbo-World Champions". When the Japanese brought their detailed and rigorous analytical approach to engine development, Ferrari had to face the fact that not only was the engine no longer the dominant part of the car, but also that Ferrari no longer necessarily built the most powerful engines." Peter Wright

Not entirely true, Williams-BMW is the most recent example that a strong engine can overcome aerodynamic shortcomings. Aerodynamics is the subterfuge of little tight-ass brit engineers who can´t design a proper engine. British GP cars were always the least powerful, and thats why Stirling Moss never won any title...

[Nortad]

Originally Posted by Memphis

Saab made planes too not sure what they did with em

Saab brags their ass off from being an aeroplane manufacturer, but so is FIAT, and that didnt stop them from making the FIAT 500/600...

Besides, SAAB aeroplane engines are made by Volvo...

Originally Posted by /NDA

Os Portuguese:

Gone fishing...

I caught a 100pound sardine!! You guys sould have seen it!!!

[/NDA]

Originally Posted by Nortad

Lie. In the end of the WWII Ferrari was barely breathing, other wise, why did they have to make new race cars out of recycled parts from the previous cars? And they only started to make road cars to finance racing, and it was like that up until the late 70´s.

It never said he hit the jack pot right then and there... replace the word "flourished" by "began". That doesn't make Ferrari any less faschist nor any less backed-up by the mafia

Stolen from Italian and German tanks. Whats wrong with that?

Well then, sell weed, what's wrong with that?

Not entirely true, Williams-BMW is the most recent example that a strong engine can overcomeaerodynamic shortcomings. Aerodynamics is the subterfuge of little tight-ass brit engineers who can´t design a proper engine. British GP cars were always the least powerful, and thats why Stirling Moss never won any title...

2000 ->
1 Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro 170 points
2 West McLaren Mercedes 152
3 BMW WilliamsF1 Team 36

2001 ->
1 Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro 179
2 West McLaren Mercedes 102
3 BMW WilliamsF1 Team 80

2002 ->
1 Scuderia Marlboro Ferrari 221
2 BMW Williams F1 Team 92

2003 ->
1 Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro 158
2 BMW WilliamsF1 Team 144

2004 ->
1 Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro 262
2 Lucky Strike BAR Honda 119
3 Mild Seven Renault F1 Team 105
4 BMW WilliamsF1 Team 88

2005 ->
1 Mild Seven Renault F1 Team 191
2 West McLaren Mercedes 182
3 Scuderia Ferrari Marlboro 100
4 Panasonic Toyota Racing 88
5 BMW WilliamsF1 Team 66

Sorry, if you don't have a complete and well balanced packaged, you just can't win a whole season. And it's not like Frank doesn't have the money. Not to mention this year results.

I caught a 100pound sardine!! You guys sould have seen it!!!

Like sushi?!

[97talon]

Thats a lot of research.

[Nortad]

Ok, before I answer, this isnt a keyboard fight, I´m just saying what I know for arguement, I dont want this to blow out of porportion.

Originally Posted by /NDA

It never said he hit the jack pot right then and there... replace the word "flourished" by "began". That doesn't make Ferrari any less faschist nor any less backed-up by the mafia

Man, Italian (and rest of war devasteded Europe) economy flowrished because of the Marshal Plan, has far has I know the máfia never had anything to do with it. I´m not saying that Enzo wasn´t a fascist or not, I dont know. What I do know is that Ferrari until it was taken over by FIAT they always were barely scraping to get by. If the Máfia was backing them up, why do they were always broke?